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“Can You Do Better?”

This is the Number One* kneejerk retort of the aggrieved author or defender thereof: “Oh, yeah, well, can YOU do any better?” I found myself responding to this so often, I decided to post it here permanently and just link to it as needed.

If you insist that one must be able to do better in order to criticize legitimately, then you have publicly forfeited forever your right to express a negative opinion of:

  • a restaurant meal, unless you are a chef
  • an 18-wheeler’s driving, unless you have a CDL
  • an athlete’s performance, unless you are a professional athlete (and a game strategy, unless you are a professional coach)
  • a pop singer, unless you are a professional musician
  • a movie, unless you are a member of the DGA
  • an elected official, unless you hold public office…

But the people who advance this idea haven’t thought their position through, naturally; they’re just trying to find a way to say “Shut up!” that will stick.


But in case it’s at all relevant: Yes, I can do better. Here are a few of the covers I’ve designed:

Arcane
Arcane II
Cross-Cultural Doctoring
The Golden Age of Crap
City of the Saints
The Demon Cross
Crecheling
It’s All About the Style

As they say on the intertubes, your argument is therefore invalid.

*The Number Two retort is “Don’t judge a book by its cover!” Which a) is completely irrelevant to judging the effectiveness of the cover itself, and b) contains the unspoken corollary, “…unless you like the cover, in which case please, assume the book is good because the cover is awesome.”

Comments

      1. His covers are on this site. See? Right there. Look up. There are links to them. They have their own post and a permanent link in the home-bar even.

        I’m not sure how you missed that. It was pretty obvious.

    1. Covers can be ok, but it doesn’t make a good storyline and covers can be terrible, it can be a great story, do yourself a favor and google this review:

      Quite possibly one of the worst books I’ve ever picked up. I would say that it is in need of significant editing (for the excessive! use! of exclamation marks! alone), but even a good editing could not salvage the cluttered and downright silly storyline.

      1. That is a pretty harsh review Yo. I hope you can use it to grow as a writer. I suggest editing your book with those things in mind. Remove some of the exclamation marks from your book(!) if there are indeed to many.

        It wouldn’t hurt to get some beta readers or a story editor to help with your silly sotryline problems! Sometimes all it takes is a little bit of refinement for something confusing and silly to become clear and powerful.

        Oh, and be sure to use CoverCritics to submit your own lousy cover to. Then people will help you to refine it, as that is what that site does, until they are downright Jealous of you.

        1. Side Note: If you actually do google that review it takes you to Amazon and the novel City of the Saints, by DJ Butler.

          A steampunk inspired book (with a nice cover) that has a bunch of positive reviews… and this one completely out of place review that just bashes it for one star.

          So thank you Yo. You have opened my eyes… to something I am sure.

  1. I’m perversely curious too, but our host here is doing the authors and artists a favor, really; he’s preventing another “The Greek Seaman” incident (and if you don’t know what I’m talking about, Google it, and you’ll see why responding to criticism is never a good idea).

    1. Thanks for that. Very entertaining! Unfortunately Howett has removed most of her comments on the original conversation.

    2. Well said , one site trashed the company I use for Publishing Indie authors. It went from vulgar to worse including my skill as an editor ( I edited very few books on the site ) and most if not all of the book covers.
      Little Alice attempted to get me to respond to un defame my company. Several emails later I laughed and said , I really don’t care what you have to say, I can’t waste my time defending something that you have already decided on. No I would no go on site to voice my opinions about yours.
      She eventually quit bothering me and life goes on.

      James

  2. Great response! I especially love the point about other examples of people judging things they know nothing about. I looked at some of the covers you’ve designed too, and you are incredibly talented. Well done you!
    *internet hand-shake and curtsy*

      1. The argument over the cover is a strange one. I agree That the first impression is important, and checking out the covers highlighted at the top of the article, I felt some of them were beautiful. But end of day, sales figures are the true test of effectiveness and the only book above with a ranking below 1million was a free book, and even its ranking in the free store is so-so. by contrast, your book is currently ranked above 35k for having been out for two years.

  3. I haven’t the time unfortunately but the books are selling. Whether they would sell better with the touch of a professional artist is quite possible though. The same ‘look’ but without the unmade-bed impression.

  4. Being a book cover artist, yeah, I can do better. I strive to make every cover the best I’ve done, to challenge my skills and to make my writers happy. But great googly moogly, I had not imagined the situation could possibly be THIS bad. There are so many free and stock photos available on the net I can’t see any excuse for this kind of work. I mean, magic markers for titles? I have to go throw up a little, now. And when did volleyball become such a hot book topic?

  5. Had to laugh at the covers here. Some looked like cheap rip offs of 1950’s SciFi movie posters, but with a child’s creativity stifled by someone who thinks they’re better than another person.

    Something to say about copyright – Does it allow you to store the copyrighted material on your site? Actually, it does not. You can link to it, but not store it for financial gain. Maybe if they wanted to hire an actual lawyer like me to go against you it would be different.

    Anyways, nice to see you make fun of people who are actually putting their names out there. Like a schoolyard bully, you should remember others will fight back. Hope one decides to knock you down.

    1. Let’s take this one part at a time, okay?

      Had to laugh at the covers here. Some looked like cheap rip offs of 1950′s SciFi movie posters, but with a child’s creativity stifled by someone who thinks they’re better than another person.

      Um… You want to try that sentence again? Because it sounds like it got away from you. Assuming I understand what you mean, some of them are supposed to have a sci-fi pop-culture vibe, it being appropriate for the book. I have never claimed to be the world’s best cover designer, but I do claim to be competent.

      Something to say about copyright – Does it allow you to store the copyrighted material on your site? Actually, it does not. You can link to it, but not store it for financial gain. Maybe if they wanted to hire an actual lawyer like me to go against you it would be different.

      Oh goodie, I get to school a lawyer. What I’m reproducing is (1) promotional media, for (2) critical purposes. According to your IP address, you’re in Canada, so I’m sure you don’t know exactly how our First Amendment works, but here’s a thought experiment: Would any author or publisher be irate at the reproduction of their cover image — with a link back to the vendor of the book — if I expressed a favorable opinion of said cover? If the answer is “no,” then what said people are objecting to is my opinion — in other words, it isn’t actionable.

      Anyways, nice to see you make fun of people who are actually putting their names out there. Like a schoolyard bully, you should remember others will fight back. Hope one decides to knock you down.

      In case you didn’t notice, my name is out there too. And there it is — the “B” word! Because if I don’t like what someone else did and tell people about it, I’m a bully! Just like at the schoolyard! There’s no difference between making a judgment call about someone’s book cover and stealing their lunch money! Except since you don’t like what I’m doing and are telling me about it, that makes you a bully too! Hell, let’s just say that everyone’s a bully if they express an opinion, because freedom of speech is of no value if it leads to disagreement and related unpleasantness, right?

      Sheesh.

      1. Nathan , really google the Greek Seaman

        Book Covers are book covers , some of yours are okay and others not as much.
        However they seemed to be designed with the audience the book is intended for.
        A book cover has only one purpose.
        Get them to look.
        If it does that, then no matter what it looks like to some people, it is doing it’s job.
        On sites like Amazon your cover will appear in two possible sizes.
        Large because your book is the one someone is looking at.
        OR
        Thumbnail size.
        Most designers don’t even consider that.
        Is the title easily readable at the small size. Do design elements still stand out?
        It is not really possible to defend against someone’s opinion, usually it is best not to try.
        If you think your book covers are doing the job and are generating sales then why worry about a possibly pretend lawyer.
        Again so it is clear.
        Bookcovers are designed to make you look and then read the blurb.
        The blurb should entice them to read the first chapter.
        If they like the first chapter, then you more than likely have a sale.
        There are a lot of elements that make a book great but consider , you bought a paperback from the store and start to read it. How often are you going to look at the cover after that?

        James

  6. The covers you yourself have “designed” are amateurish. Your design “skills” are at the most basic level imaginable. The idea that you have set up a web site to criticize other amateurs is laughable. Your bullying is sad to behold. This site is a disgrace.

    1. Yes, Robby, we all know that you’re personally offended at me and are willing to lash out to prove it.

    2. Yeah, I disagree. I think Nathan’s covers are actually pretty damn good. If I self-publish my own novel, I hope I get cover art that’s as good as what he’s done.

  7. Actually, his covers are pretty good. Methinks I smell the ire of one of the artists of those horrendous covers. Or perhaps the author. Bad art is bad art, there ain’t no gettin around it. Unfortunately, desperate authors hire amateur artists or friends and get exactly what they don’t pay for.

  8. I’m offended at you? Really? I have no idea who you are. And certainly no DESIRE to know! The fact is, your work is amateurish. Of course you will do ANYTHING but admit this, but the fact remains. Naturally you will never admit your own failings, but where do you get off running a site that criticizes the work of others when you yourslef have so little talent? If you like, I can supply you with some personal information about myself. This will facilitate your endless ad hominem attacks. I think I’ll start a site attacking YOUR covers, and see how you like it.

      1. What is he? 14? And I can assure you, Nathan, that all Canadians are not this dumb.

        Yes, your First Amendment is something of a head-scratcher to us, usually polite Canadians (there are some sad exceptions as you can see). But that’s no reason to impose our views on others.

  9. If you can’t take criticism, you’re in the wrong biz, “Robby Reed”. Please note that website link of mine above. I’ll post it again:

    http://ideatrash.net/2013/12/i-made-lousy-book-cover-once-learn-from.html

    Own your mistakes. Learn from them. Write a better book. Design a better cover. Be a REAL writer or publisher.

    Or whine and melt down and have the internet laugh at you.

    (Search “author meltdown” if you don’t believe me, man.

  10. Sweet! I *am* a professional musician–does that mean I have a free pass to mock America’s Got Talent contestants as much as I’ve always wanted now?

  11. The Arcane covers are positively creepy. Well done. Cross-cultural Doctoring works well. Inviting. I think The Golden Age of Crap needs a border or something. The white background blends in with the white background of the Amazon page. I don’t understand why the words on City of the Saints are wonky but otherwise it’s okay. My attention is drawn to the animalistic eyes on The Demon Cross. It took a few seconds to see the swastika and realize that is what the title means. Crecheling works but the colours made me think it was a book from the fifties or sixties. It’s All About the Style is great. IMHO.

    1. Thanks. Like I said, I never claimed to be the best cover designer, but I do proudly proclaim the ones above to be adequate and competent.

  12. Nathan,

    I love your sub-title by the way, “just because you can design your own cover doesn’t mean you should” because it applies to so many things. It applies in business when it comes to advertising or packaging, home improvement when your husband states he’ll fix the kitchen sink when he doesn’t have a clue of what he’s doing, and self-image when you attempt to cut your hair, but can’t see the back for a decent finish, and so forth.

    Which brings me to ask why do people do these things? The number one reason is to save money. The second reason some actually believe they’re capable of and good at these tasks. Why???

    The above cover is an excellent example of why people shouldn’t conduct I’ll do it myself experiments if I can save money. For one, It takes away from the branding the author is trying to build and second the author will not sell as many copies as he/she could have with a professional graphic designer.

    Yes, the cover grabs your attention for a quick view but, it doesn’t jump out and say buy me the content inside is good, so in the end all the author has done is wasted his/her time, money, and energy.

    Ta’ni
    http://www.mienexpress.com

  13. My first cover appeared on here, photo-manip, so I treated it as a ‘Must try harder’ and went back and did it again with the aid of a kindle download ‘Paintshop Pro Killer Tips’ by Simon Walden.

    Photo manipulation and Paint Shop will not work for my next undertaking so I would like to add a serious bit of advice for authors looking for a cover artist.

    You get what you pay for, but do not expect to just be paying for the end product if you go to an established artist. Luis Royo and Frans Mensink will not take time out from paid work in order to send you a free ‘rough’, and so expect to pay £125 for each of those samples until you get it right.
    Create your own visual concept of what you want and couple it with a written brief explaining the dimension and pixel count required along with guidance that dark, warm colours, may make a thing of beauty on a book shelf but they may go unnoticed in an online bookstore. The visual and the detailed brief equate to fewer roughs, and you should also learn the difference between 3D CG Rendering and Digital Painting.
    The Renderer is limited by the available models, backgrounds and sets that they have at their disposal and the digital painters are less numerous.

    The way around expensive roughs is to go to several less well known artists and ask them to compete. Established artists will not do that and the artists guild advises them against the practice. The established artists also do not like being asked how much it will cost.

    Expect to receive enthusiastic initial responses followed by silence, and emailed queries as to progress that go ignored. I googled a fair amount but ten dry holes over several months was the unhappy result of trying that.
    I eventually went to a site called deviantart.com, although there are a number of similar artists collectives sites, which contains every type of artist you can imagine, from potters to 3DCG Animators, and I posted a notice with several digital painters groups message boards, but no one responded, and this was because in the virtual world as well as in life, people walk past notice boards without giving them a glance.

    I next went through the sites galleries and wrote a list, the names of ten young and talented amateurs whose work I liked, and messaged them individually. Five replied, although one of those merely stated that he did not do commissions. The remaining four received the visual and the brief, two wanted to read extracts from the book first, but all stated that they wanted the gig and would provided free roughs.
    I waited, and waited for a fortnight before emailing each one, and as had occurred before I met with silence from some, three of the four could not be induced to respond but the fourth produced solid gold.

    Be patient, set aside $1000 if you go to an established name, and be clear and concise in what your concept for the cover is with as good a visual as you can manage, and I patched and pasted the various elements from about the net for this.

    Good luck.

  14. Oh dear. I have no clue what it is I just read. Did you use an online translator? Looks like it because none of this makes sense. Clear and concise is something you don’t know how to do apparently.

    I don’t know why you’re sharing this at all, because all this jumbled stuff you wrote just reflects on your lack of understanding of the process. This is so not the way to engage with digital artists. No wonder they left you high and dry.

    And a $1000 for a book cover? This is just ridiculous. Especially for an unknown writer that can’t put two sentences together.

    Even if you use an established name, as you said, your cover is still going to look like crap. You just made it really clear that you don’t know what a good book cover looks like or even how or where to get one.

    OMG I just found your website. Is this a joke? Please tell me it’s a joke. My advice? Never ever design anything ever again. You’re totally design-blind.

    Contact a book cover designer that specializes in your genre, give them the synopsis of your book. And shut up. A week and a 100-150 bucks later, you have a book cover. You’re going to hate it, but that’s going to be a good sign that it’s really good. If you like it, don’t use it: it’s ugly. Rinse and repeat for your website, but this time hire a web designer.

    1. Lucie, I think he made a lot of good points (and I certainly had no trouble following his prose). And if what you want is competent *custom art,* then $1000 is not an unreasonable sum.

      1. Believe me, Nathan, I didn’t answer so harshly on a whim: I read some of his posts on his website, too. But if you think my comment was uncalled for, please delete it.

        I totally agree with you that custom art is worth the money. What I have an issue with is the way he went about it.

        _”My first cover appeared on here, photo-manip, so I treated it as a ‘Must try harder’ and went back and did it again with the aid of a kindle download ‘Paintshop Pro Killer Tips’ by Simon Walden.”_ This first sentence started my frenzy. One: it makes no sense, prose-wise. Two: the covers still look like crap.

        _”Photo manipulation and Paint Shop will not work for my next undertaking.”_ Dude, it did not work for the last ones either.

        _”The way around expensive roughs is to go to several less well known artists and ask them to compete. Established artists will not do that and the artists guild advises them against the practice.”_ But he still did it. Which made me wonder if he was that clueless or if he just didn’t care.

        _”Expect to receive enthusiastic initial responses followed by silence, and emailed queries as to progress that go ignored.”_ If I was an artist, I wouldn’t want my name affixed to his idea of art either. They were just too polite to tell him.

        There’s a lot he’s not telling us here but it’s easy to read between the lines (especially after reading his blog posts) what his unrealistic expectations and demands were.

        1. Slightly long winded but all the relevant information is there, and posted as a helpful advisory by someone who may never make the New York Times, but is not exactly unsuccessful either, and using the very covers he mentioned. (Google Search and Amazon UK)

          He is attacked by a designer of book covers, the most expensive I saw was $89, so pretty much stock quality for the vanity press market. Yes, you heard correctly, a budget book cover designer is attacking writers with a $1000 to spend on a book cover.

          The attacker though, is screaming “Please, please, someone, tell me I am clever!”

          A smart person is recognized as such within a single sentence, but the attacker uses two hundred and forty-eight words that include personal insults.
          Mr Shumate, the blog owner, uses few words in stating he disagrees with the attacker, and why.
          The attacker desperately tries to make amends with the site owner with a further two hundred and sixty two words, including further insults, to justify the post.

          So, no class, no unprofessionalism, and certainly not clever.

          1. I thought you were talking about me, Pepe le Pew. But then you said: He is attacked by a designer of book covers, the most expensive I saw was $89, so pretty much stock quality for the vanity press market.

            I’m in the clear. That’s not me.

            And since I’m not hiding behind a pseudo, that’s pretty easy to verify.

            1. I don’t get it, I really don’t?
              For one thing your website is not doing your business justice.
              And there is a lot of character and a winning smile in those photos, so are you only posting when you have a bad day?
              Be a nice person to do business with and you will do a lot more business Lucie, I sell used cars in Belfast for a living so I know what I’m talking about.

              If I ever get around to writing ‘Keeping your hubcaps, kneecaps, and still making a sale’ (Even the titles a winner, right? right?) I’ll look you up.

              1. I have no idea who you think I am. I don’t have a business, so no website can do it justice or not, I’m not a book designer and I don’t post pictures of myself.

                I am usually a really nice person and I give almost all of my free time to self-published authors in need of copy editing or of audiobook editing. Since I am crippled, that’s a lot of time.

                You misunderstand me when thinking I was against giving artists more money. I’m against THIS guy using money to lure young artists into giving him free artwork. He says so himself: “I will obviously pay for the cover I LIKE.” “The way around expensive roughs is to go to SEVERAL LESS WELL KNOWN ARTISTS and ask them to COMPETE.”

                What infuriates me is people harassing artists and pitching them one against another. It’s abusing young artists’ hopes.

                What infuriates me is people butchering good art, even if they paid it $1000 (if you read attentively you’ll realize this offer stands ONLY for ESTABLISHED names), thus risking to ruin the artists’ reputation. Because this guy is still going to do a mess of the layout.

                So yes, I was very angry when I commented and I used strong words. And I was really hoping the author would come back and explain himself.

          2. And still not making sense, you know? Same ridiculous syntax as Mr Farman. Friend of yours?

  15. No, don’t look at my website. It isn’t alive yet. I’m trying to figure out how to do a blog.

    Being a writer and artist, I do covers for fairly low prices. But I’m fortunate in that I don’t depend on writing or art for my financial support. If I did, there would be a whole other story. This way, I get to do what I love and constantly challenge myself to do better and better.

    Most of my work is done for my publisher. Recently, she wanted to use a couple of my old cover designs. This is fine, but as I am so much better now than I was then, and my style became established fully, I could not allow those old covers to go out the way they stood to represent my work. So I’ve basically been redoing them. Which means taking the original image, retexturing everything, redoing the color balance, changing colors and contrasts, in some cases replacing objects entirely and modifying the lighting. And spending much time thinking to myself ‘why didn’t I do it that way in the first place’. The image was quite monochromatic in the original, now it has color and contrast and the objects that need to stand out, do stand out.

    It’s been kind of a fascinating process, and great fun actually. And a challenge. As will be the title strip, which is always what font do I use, what effects, what do I want it to look like. The first cover I redid wasn’t so bad or so much work. It was almost good enough, just needed to fiddle with the color balance and retouch a few things. But I did an experiment with the title text that turned out amazingly, but that I can’t reuse on the second redo. Darn it.

    I say that to explain that you have to put thought and skills and time into a good cover. Even if you’re just using a stock photograph, you still have to color balance it and make it look right and fit the book. You don’t make a cover by just throwing disparate elements together and hoping it works. It takes thought and study and planning. And even after that, it’s still going to change on you while you’re doing it and you’re going to discover new things, new elements. What Bob Ross called ‘happy accidents’. Heck, the blending operations in Photoshop alone deserve a book to demonstrate what can be done by a creative mind.

    The covers that were set as examples here share one thing in common. They’re thoughtless and inexperienced. A couple of them could have been dandy covers if the artist had just had the skills and taken the time to do them right. Several others make me shudder at their badness. I’m not holding myself up as the best cover artist since Frazetta or anything. I’m good, but I’m always learning, experimenting, challenging myself to make each cover better than the one before.

    1. Sadly, the site Mediocre Book Covers closed after two very hard years with little traffic. It was a good site overall, nicely designed, a few nice members, but just didn’t have the same zing factor as here.

      The creator of that site eventually killed himself in the most mediocre way possible, (drowning in plain flavoured jello) as her life was in a shambles.

      And all because of people like you. Who wouldn’t support her. You should be ashamed of yourself.

    2. Speaking seriously, I’ve considered using the Amazon beta cover designer for my novella and novelette, but none of the canned images seem to work for these stories. I am definitely not an artist, in any way, shape, or form, so I wasn’t tempted to use my own images. Or else my covers would be winning prizes for worst in show.

      Plain is better, imo, than awful.

      For my Kindle novels I worked with two different photo-montage artists, whose prices were pretty reasonable, and with whose results I have been very satisfied. In the future, however, I might just start using the same images for my Kindle novel covers I am using for the Createspace editions, esp. since one of the montage artists is no longer in the business.

      The moral– you can get decent covers for a small amount of money, patience, and a drop or two of humility.

  16. Aw, I was kind of hoping this was a “submit your own improvements” page. That would have been a potentially interesting project.

    As to the authors (or artists, or whatever you are) complaining here, I’m inclined to think if your cover is bizarre enough to be featured on a “bad covers” site like this one, you may yet fail your way to fame and fortune like McKittrick Ros, whose unintentionally humorous book Irene Iddesleigh helped fill the lives of the Inklings and so very, very many others with hours of laughter.

  17. Nathan Shumate,

    Best of luck on your website! We are grateful to have such a champion to promote a higher standard of artistic book cover designs. Through your insights, we will gradually have superior book cover art as a standard. (Something akin to the obviously higher quality book covers you utilize…)

    I am curious, has your business profit margin increased since producing this website?

    1. Lame as it sounds, I honestly can’t tell if this is (hyperbolically) sincere or sarcastic.

      As I’ve said several times on this site, I have no illusions that I’m one of the greatest cover designers ever; I do know, however, that I am a) marginally competent, and b) objective enough about my own skills to know whether I’ve tackled something I can’t pull off.

      As to the “business profit margin” (I assume you’re referring to cover design specifically): This site is not a solicitation for work on my part. Actually, I don’t really solicit design work at all, instead just doing the odd design job for acquaintances. (I did hang out a shingle for a short time a couple of years ago, but projects always seemed to arrive in clumps when I was already busy; I decided to ditch it.) For a long time, LousyBookCovers.com had no reference to any design experience on my part, since I didn’t think it really was relevant — you don’t need to be a world-class chef to know if your roommate’s cooking sucks. But the titular question was thrown in my face by defensive “special snowflake” self-publishers so often that I put up this page simply to ward off that particular bit of irrelevant denial.

  18. That ‘Stop Author Bullying’ lot generally say they’re liberals. They should read J.S. Mill’s seminal “On Liberty”-WELL!

  19. Occasionally, I wonder about the amazing covers with the shitty books behind them. The bulk of the bad covers don’t seem to be on masterpiece books. It doesn’t seem to just be an issue of affording better covers. Maybe these books DO have the covers they deserve. Like a creativity biohazard symbol.

    1. You’re generally right ,but good book/bad cover IS seen in SF with a shoddy spaceship&star on cover & NEVER in the text.

  20. “Yes, I can do better. Here are a few of the covers I’ve designed”

    Sorry, but I looked at some of those’wonderful’covers of yours and IMO they ain’t so wonderful. Some are average and some, I’d say, stink. But like they say, beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

    I understand that there are a lot of books out there with substandard covers, and I to have cringed at some of them, but I looked at some you are criticising and what this looks like to me is a lot of just juvenile trollishness. Attack for the sake of attack to get a reaction (and notoriety?) and to try make oneself sound like an authority. Anybody can criticize anything if THEY didn’t personally have a hand in it. It’s easy! It’s always easier to tear something down than to build it up. But fortunately (so far at least) everyone doesn’t have to think the same way, or like the same things.

  21. Okaaaaaay . . . . bad book covers . . . right up my alley! I enjoy making covers for books that I make up–parodies. I do it for fun and because I really enjoy looking at old paperback covers, especially of sci-fi and fantasy era of the 60s and 70s. So I’m going to throw this out there and see what y’all think . . . be brutal! On a very few I use my own artwork, a 3d render or graphic, but mostly I get the artwork from fotolia or shutterstock, think up a title (or use a title generator) and lay it out. I write all the blurbs. Check it out and see what you think . . . http://tony41454.tumblr.com. Oh, yeah, I just do this for fun. I don’t do commissions.

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